Talk:Vote to rework membership points

Brain dump:

• skip the discount - that seems like a nightmare to manage
  • removing, it has not been successfully in the past --Hef (talk) 11:58, 16 October 2014 (CDT)
• qualify "currently $30" with a date
  • I am going to remove it entirely --Hef (talk) 11:58, 16 October 2014 (CDT)
• onus of claiming points MUST be on member - contact board by current method (currently info@) within 1 month of event
  • Noteing onus on member --Hef (talk)
  • ignoring 1 month, as the practice is up to the BoD --Hef (talk) 12:01, 16 October 2014 (CDT)
• expiry is hard to track --Dbever (talk) 02:18, 30 July 2014 (UTC)
• Please get rid of the word may in the phrase "Members may be awarded Membership Points". 'May' just sounds like legalese and everyone argues about what it means. --Bry (talk) 13:02, 16 October 2014 (CDT)
  • done --Hef (talk) 13:48, 16 October 2014 (CDT)

Things that Get Member points

I moved this text into the main vote page --Hef (talk) 13:40, 16 October 2014 (CDT)

From the list

• The issue I see is that Hef's proposal seeks to eliminate the automatic awarding of points. I think this will adversely impact the organization, create more workload for the Board, and fail to meet the policy objectives that member points are supposed to encourage. (ryan)
• OK, I'll say it. Nobody likes exposing themselves to rejection. Having to justify one's awesomeness to the Board and ask them to consider awarding points feels... awkward. Like self-promoting and asking for a handout. People don't like to do it. (ryan)
  • In the current policy, we encourage member's to promote each other, and the BoD rejects very few proposals for points. I don't see any reason for this to change --Hef (talk) 21:37, 16 October 2014 (CDT)
• A mechanical model of "Do X, get Y points" is a great way to get people to do X. It takes value judgements out of the mix. For things we want to encourage, like teaching classes, running events, and doing authorizations, it is a great model. (Ryan)
  • I agree. I think we both feel the current policy is vague. I think we differ on execution. --Hef (talk) 21:37, 16 October 2014 (CDT)
  • regarding value judgement: For the most part, the value judgements are only made when relevant, as in a new idea or activity. Once the decision is made it would be documented in the wiki. This also allows for flexibility in handling future needs of the space. --Hef (talk) 21:37, 16 October 2014 (CDT)

• It also makes life easier for the Board. The whole Board shouldn't need to think about it, and could probably delegate it so it doesn't take up time at the Board meetings. The Board will still need to evaluate cases that don't fit into the mechanical model, but won't be bothered with routine stuff. (Ryan)
  • As a Board member, and I know this is counter intuitive, but additional language adds complexity, which increases the time points take to process. --Hef (talk) 21:50, 16 October 2014 (CDT)
  • Regarding evaluating cases that don't fit into the mechanical model: I'd like those evaluations to change the mechanical model as they arise. --Hef (talk) 21:50, 16 October 2014 (CDT)
  • Currently, delegating points doesn't work do to crm restrictions. I'd like to change that with technology in the near future. --Hef (talk) 21:37, 16 October 2014 (CDT)
• Hef's proposal seems like it would create more work for the Board, since there are no automatic approvals. (Ryan)
  • The accounting difference between automatic and non is very minimal. The current workflow works like this:
    • Person emails BoD
    • BoD has a quick vote to approve points and/or affirm that the activity gets a point
    • Member point award gets recorded in minutes
    • Member point recipient gets note recorded in CRM

The complexity comes in the bizarre frequency of discussion on whether or not we need to to vote, what the vote is for, and whether or not an activity qualifies as automatic, how the actions scale, If multiple people were involved, who gets the points, etc. --Hef (talk) 21:37, 16 October 2014 (CDT)

• Does it include bounties for authorization, which is what Elizabeth originally wanted to address? (Ryan)
  • yes --Hef (talk) 21:37, 16 October 2014 (CDT)
• Does it reduce the attendance number on classes? (Ryan)
  • Yes. --Hef (talk) 21:37, 16 October 2014 (CDT)
    • I don't see that. The supplemental wiki page lists 5, same as the existing policy. (Ryan)

Why do member points take so much board time

I'm seriously confused by why this has taken so much Board time.

You can give someone a Member Point for any reason. Saying yes to requests should be trivial. The only time you need to examine the rules is if the Board wants to say no. And I didn't think that was common.

What am I missing here? (Ryan)

Reason

They shouldn't take as much time as they do. That's why I want to reduce the complexity in what points are. --Hef (talk) 21:50, 16 October 2014 (CDT)

Do points work

Do we have any evidence that people are actually motivated by member points? (Ron Bean)

Not directly

No direct evidence, no. People do claim them, and a few people teach regular classes in order to claim them every month.

Not entirely unrelated, there are also several volunteer positions being opened up in order to address tool training issues. --Hef (talk) 21:52, 16 October 2014 (CDT)